#mike sexuality analysis

[gayofthefae]

Thinking about Mike, who is confirmed to not have liked girls before season 1.

Thinking about Mike, and the terrifying queer experience of standing right next to your straight friend who keeps being called gay, shaking, silent, terrified thinking, "They got the wrong one. Just don't draw attention to yourself."

Thinking about Mike, who in some ways was shielded by Will in that.

Thinking about Mike when Will went missing, and how without Will around to target it at, Troy took his homophobia to Mike. It was still about Will, but it was only a matter of time.

Thinking about Mike, just a kid, terrified of getting caught.

Thinking about Mike and the timing of it all.

[gayofthefae]

I love that it's the season after their bonding and joy too.

"What makes you happiest is actually the joy you feel when you're free" because what Jonathan says isn't exactly "don't like the stuff people want you to", it's "like the stuff you do". In the way that you do.

He likes El. Just not how he's supposed to. And that scene before Jonathan says that is about that. About the fact that he likes El.

It's what they're story is all about: that not being together isn't bad or worse. The scene isn't about him feeling like he's being forced to like her. It's about him being so happy with her when he's free from the romantic pressures towards her of the people around him.

So, we all know that in s1, Lucas is mad at Mike for spending so much time with El and even Dustin tells Mike later on: “[…] and then this girl shows up and starts living in your basement, and all you ever wanna do is pay attention to her.”

Clearly, Lucas’ and Dustin’s only evidence as to why they think that Mike is in love with El is the fact that he spends time with her/pays more attention to her and it all starts with Mike skipping school to stay at home with El. At home Mike shows El around and later finds out that El knows something about Will and from then on he mostly defends her and approaches her even friendlier. He chooses to believe her and tells Dustin and Lucas to do the same which especially Lucas thinks is absolutely insane. Nonetheless Mike stands up for her instead of siding with Lucas and that leads to Lucas accusing Mike of being in love with El.

And the crucial point is that Lucas accuses Mike unprompted and phrases his accusation in a way that erases all indications that this is his personal opinion. It sounds like he’s talking about a general fact:

“If you love her so much, why don’t you marry her?” -> Lucas’ way of wording implies that Mike’s mannerisms alone already give away that he’s in love with El. It’s not Lucas who simply perceives Mike to be in love with El, no, Mike conveys it all on his own. But this obviously isn’t the truth of the situation which is why Mike is pretty confused by Lucas’ statement.

“You look at her all like ‘Oh El, El, El, El, El, El! Will you marry me?’” -> Again, Lucas’ choice of words implies that it’s a general fact that Mike looks at El a certain way which shows that he’s in love with her, instead of telling Mike that he personally picked Mike’s look up at something romantic.

Lucas doesn’t say “I think you’re in love with El” he says “You are in love with El” and therefore basically dictates Mike on who he is and who he likes. But of course Lucas isn’t the only one who does that.

Right after Dustin explains to Mike why Lucas is jealous [and says the quote from the top of this post] Mike tells him “That’s not true.” which Dustin replies to with:

“It’s true and you know it!” -> Just like Lucas, Dustin tells Mike what is true and what is not and completely disregards Mike’s own opinion on the topic. He tells Mike that him being in love with El is the general and overall truth which is obvious to everyone and he even goes a step further and dictates Mike on what he knows and what he doesn’t!! Which then leads to Mike thinking that maybe he should be in love with her!

Even later in the season Nancy asks Mike “Do you like El?” and by doing so she unknowingly proves Lucas and Dustin right. Mike’s behavior does show that he’s in love with El, it is obvious to everyone around him and therefore him being in love with El must be the truth/fact!! But why doesn’t he feel anything then? Why can anyone else see it but he himself can’t? Shouldn’t he feel something? Shouldn’t he see it too? Yeah, he should. But why doesn’t he? Is there something wrong with him? Oh god, is there? No, it’s just like Dustin said, he’s just being oblivious to his own feelings. He is in love with El just like everyone else says! Because he’s supposed to be. And therefore he should be. Therefore he has to be. Therefore he is.

You’re probably wondering why I highlighted “Mike skipping school to stay at home”, right?

Well, as I said, that’s where it all starts. It’s the first time Mike ditches Lucas and Dustin to spend time with El. It’s that day that Mike starts to defend El and therefore it’s the reason everyone starts thinking he’s in love with her. And the first scene [so the beginning of the beginning] of Mike showing El around the house [the scene that ends with El on the La-Z-boy] is followed by no other scene than Jonathan driving to Lonnie’s place which contains the flashback of him telling Will:

“You shouldn’t like things just because people tell you you’re supposed to”

That’s literally the next scene after we first get Mike and El spending actual time together!!! It’s already such a queer coded line for just Will, and from then on all throughout the season we also get different people telling Mike that he’s supposed to like El!! But the problem is that Mike never got told that he doesn’t have to like things that people tell him he’s supposed to! He never had that conversation with anyone ever and so Mike doesn’t know that he doesn’t have to be in love with El just because people tell him he’s supposed to. And so of course he lets himself get pressured into behaving like he is in love with her, even though he isn’t.

[pinksmonkey]

Posting my Ultimate Byler Evidence/Analysis List here directly because it probably makes it more convenient and I should have done this a while ago. XD

There is so much proof for Byler being endgame in S5 of Stranger Things. They are so cute together, and so much in the show has been building up to their relationship. I just wanted to share some of my favourite Byler analyses, because they are so cool, detailed, and in-depth. I love reading about all the hints, symbolism, and subtext for Byler, it's amazing how much thought must have been put into all these things. Why go through all the effort of adding these details if they aren't actually going anywhere with them? Mike is so queercoded, and they are truly in love with each other.

🫥 Just gonna leave some good Byler analyses here 🤐

Most of the links go to written Tumblr posts, and a couple of them are Reddit posts. So it's a lot of reading. If you prefer watching videos over reading, I highlighted my Byler YouTube playlist in green so it's easy to find.

And apologies for any of the links that aren't working, I know some of the posts have been deleted now sadly, but there's no way I'm re-numbering all these so I'm just leaving them in. My fellow Bylers, please stop deleting your amazing posts. ;-;

So anyway, here is the list of some of my favourite Byler evidence/analyses of all time (not in any particular order):

1. Mike's Season 4 Monologue To El

2. Camera Roll Byler Proof Part 3

3. Mike's Monologue and Milkvan

4. Mostly Byler Post Index

5. Dawson's Creek Parallel

6. "My Experience With Stranger Things"

7. What Ollie Learned From Film School

8. Byler Music Analysis

9. Why Don't The Duffers Discuss This?

10. ST Theories Masterpost

11. If Byler Isn't Endgame Then Someone Screwed Up

12. Byler Crumbs From The Cast and Crew

13. Favourite Combination of Endgame Byler Proof

14. I Doubt Byler Then I Remember This

15. The Fact That We Have This Interview

16. You Know Your Ship is Endgame When

17. Mostly Byler Post Index 2

18. Losing Hope Of Byler Endgame?

19. Why I Think Byler is Endgame

20. So Many Thoughts on This

21. Mike's Wall Art

22. Painting Miscommunication Leading to Mike's Monologue Coded

23. Yes, That Scene Did Foreshadow Mike's Monologue as Disingenuous

24. Mike's Monologue Didn't Sit Right With Me

25. Blue And Yellow Pen

26. That Tweet Is So Sweet

27. Heart Eyes, Literally

28. "My Process of Realizing Byler is Real"

29. Looking at Will, Not El

30. High School Musical Parallel

31. Said It Before and I'll Say It Again

32. Delusional Milkdud?

33. ST Writers Twitter Analysis 1

34. ST Writers Twitter Analysis 2

35. For When You Are Doubting Byler

36. Is Mike Bi or Gay?

37. Fully Convinced

38. The Ultimate Byler Playlist (my Byler YouTube playlist)

39. 100% Confident

40. Mike in S4 and S2

41. Mike Is Angry With Himself

42. It's Been A Year, Mike

43. Rink-O-Mania Remodel

44. The Development Of Will And Mike's Relationship

45. Mike's Lies

46. El Was Holding So Much In

47. Flickergate + Lettergate

48. Did Mike Ever Like El Romantically?

49. Mike Is Stupid

50. Byler Won't Write Itself

51. What's The Alternative Explanation?

52. Comparing Mileven and Byler

53. It Was Always About Them

54. Mike Is Not Ok

55. He Has A Love Interest

56. Will's Happy Ending

57. Trying To Be Normal

58. It's Not That Milevens Are Homophobic

59. Byler Is Reality

60. A Proper Look At El's Shrine To Mike

61. Mileven Through The Seasons

62. Suspicious

63. I Can't Doubt Byler

64. D&D Soulmates

65. Let's Talk Phones

66. Not Delusional

67. What Do They Want?

68. The Main Character

69. Mike's Mental Health

70. So Close

71. This Look Confirms Byler Isn't One Sided

72. Mileven Is Bones

73. They Don't Care About Mileven?

74. The Airport Hug Will Always Be Famous

75. The Monologue Mystery, Why Did They Lose?

76. The Cabin Scene

77. Why Couldn't Mike Say It For 2 Seasons?

78. He Was Trying To Find Will

79. Mike The Surfer Boy

80. Mike Definitely Shows Attraction To Girls

81. The Cast Knows

82. Mileven Loses On All Fronts

83. The Bouquet

84. 53 Minutes And 5 Seconds

85. Pink Panther

86. El And Choice

87. Will's Spotify Playlist

88. He'll Come Crawling Back To You, Begging For Forgiveness

89. Mike's Character Arc Prediction

90. It's The Same Look

91. Will's Truly Happy Ending

92. That's The Same Look, Right?

93. You're The Heart

94. Mike And El's Relationship In S4 Was Really Weird

95. Fireworks Parallel

96. Mileven Has Been Built Up For 4 Seasons

97. Not Stupid: The Fate of Mileven and Byler

98. This Suddenly Makes So Much Sense

99. Metaphors In Filmmaking

And unfortunately Tumblr will only let me add 100 links per post, so when I've posted part 2 of this list, I'll link it here: Part 2

[counting-stars-gayly]

They’re not going to rebuild Castle Byers because Will can’t rebuild his childhood, which is the reason he destroyed Castle Byers in the first place. He’d been trying to hold on to a level of carefree ignorance that no longer existed for him. The problems Castle Byers saved him from have been replaced by new problems that are bigger and stronger than a child’s fort. He needs to face them differently. Thank you and goodnight

[byler-invested]

Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles x Stranger Things official comic

Be prepared, because… there’s…..….

A LOT.

> “11 o’clock” in focus for no reason (Eleven symbolizes Will’s closet, internalised homophobia, innocence, virginity).

> open yellow curtain (probably signifies Will coming out in s5).

> “theme for the day” (meaning this sequence is thematic of something: Will’s trauma and coming of age).

> “Do whatever you want. Go see Mike and the boys… it’s up to you” (this refers to the perceived freedom of Will coming out or starting his sexual life).

> “not a trick?” (It is a trick unfortunately…)

> “Nope. I’ll even be your chauffeur if you need me. That means I’ll drive.” (gay top subtext)

> “For once, freedom is on the other side of that door. And it’s all yours.” (!!! — someone coercing Will into the gay sexual lifestyle before he’s ready or in an unsafe manner).

> Eggos and maple syrup are Mike coded. But orange juice is NOT! Mike would drink and is associated to white milk. This is a subtle hint that something’s WRONG.

“Technical” meaning in s5 they will start to delve into the mythology of the series.

But also… sexual subtext.

> “Time to get a move on, kid. Go before I realize this is a huge mistake” (something or someone coercing Will into letting go of heteronormativity and virginity).

> “It won’t… open”, “Just give it a push. You get everything you’ve ever wanted and you’re going to let a door stop you? There you go. Put some muscle into it.” (clearly subtext about coming out and first sexual experience from a bottom’s perspective).

Dustin is Jonathan in s5 when he realizes Will is being manipulated/ coerced by some guy.

The alarmed/ surprised turtle on the right is Lucas.

Raph (on the left) is Mike— he’s PISSED. Jealous Mike absolutely CONFIRMED.

> “Most importantly… why does Stockman want to open a gate, and why do they need him hooked up to that machine, too?” Lucas is absolutely shocked that the top (it’s his former basketball teammate Chance) is into guys and that Will, of all people, would be into Chance.

> “There are no good reasons to open a gate. They’re always bad.” Jonathan is protective of his little brother to whom he also represents a father figure. To him, it can never be good that Will’s having a sexual experience.

> “Maybe that machine is using her powers against her?” Meaning Chance is a dark mirror/ foil of Mike and one of the made-up characters we’ve been talking about.

> “Where are you going, Raph?” Lucas is surprised that Mike is so pissed and already springing into action (he won’t have come out at this point).

> “I’m gonna do the rescuing!” White Knight paladin Mike moment.

> “You can’t pull Eleven out. The mind is fragile.” (Will is in a vulnerable situation).

> “Donny, relax. I wasn’t talking about rescuing the girl”. This is the writers telling us this is all a metaphor and they’re not talking about Eleven, but Byler. They even make a point of showing us a bunch of Byler and Mike-coded stuff in the next image: two crossed swords, a walkie-talkie, Mike’s backpack and a huge phallic object…

> Mike makes use of his coding/ programming skills (Alan Turing reference).

> “Well, the two of them are definitely linked”. Mike and Chance are linked in some way.

> “Wait, so this whole thing is designed to create a big illusion? To feed Eleven a lie?” The writers referring to their gigantic five season long straightbait but also, manifestation theory IKTR.

> “Only those inside can shut down the projection”. Like I suspected, the scientists fucked up and Brenner as the lab leader was probably the one who made this decision of ‘trapping’ everyone in the simulation. Also subtext for “only those in Will’s trust and heart can shut down his illusion” aka Mike.

> Nice reference to The Cabin in the Woods movie there in the first pic (heavily recommend).

> Mike doesn’t even ask anyone and just brutally storms in to interrupt whatever Will and Chance are doing.

> We could even infer that his extreme jealousy straight up brutally OUTS Mike, not only to the audience, but maybe also to other characters. He unintentionally crashes down his own closet…

> “That’s not your friend.” Mike telling Will this about Chance.

> The background changes to orange as the villain (Chance) loses his disguise/ farce.

> “Fine, I’ll gladly stop pretending to be this buffoon.” Chance stops pretending to be nice and/or is revealed to be a Vecna/ Mindflayer trap.

> “Like it or not… this place is mine”. Mike and Chance will fight and compete for Will.

Note: Chance is heavily associated with orange even in the show, because of being a Tiger in the basketball team.

TAKEAWAY:

Unfortunately, I think at some point in s5— besides the supernatural plotline— we are about to witness Will delve into real unhealthy coping mechanisms (prematurity, hypersexuality, low self-worth and/or drugs) and reliving the trauma with his father (attraction to unhealthy people, as Chance will remind Will of a mix of both Mike and Lonnie).

These are extremely common results of CSA in many people.

Jonathan, Lucas and especially Mike will save him.

There’s a lot more. I just picked some of the most incriminating pages lmfao. And I’ll leave you with this Paladin Mike bonus:

[gayofthefae]

Yes. Everything, yes!

Everything about him feeling like he had to continue because she was initiating in season 2 I am BIG on. The playlist totally supports this, with the song about her being more "I'm so grateful to have you back I won't lose you again" than "I'm in love with you". He's clinging to what he promised her last time. I also think there's definitely a lot with broken promises there. When she was dead, he was off the hook, but now, the feelings he was having for Will are a broken promise to her and he's waiting to see if that promise is still viable. She says that it is.

And now with initiation I'm also thinking about how Mike is pretty much the only one to initiate things between him and Mike, in contrast - especially physical touch. Which is why Will not getting a call is so surprising and also why he wouldn't be habitually inclined to call back, because that's not his usual role between them. Will's role is very much "reciprocator": "Crazy together, right?" "Yeah".

And with "I love her and I can't lose her again", it's really interesting, because "I love her" is not the focus of the statement in delivery. It's "iloveherandi CAN'T lose her again." Similarly, the focus isn't on "I care for you". It's "I care for you SO MUCH" He means the things he says, they just weren't for the purpose people take them for. He does love her, but he doesn't want her to take it wrong if she doesn't have to. He's trying to leave it vague. Not another broken promise. If he says "blank", she assumed what blank was. If he never signs his letters, it was her assumption that he loved her back. On a technical level, he wouldn't be making any promises to be broken.

He loves her and he wants her back in his life but the story could have gotten them back together before the epilogue (and before Hopper died) and didn't. There wasn't too much action, they did it with Lum@x (yet another example of them demonstrating their straight couple writing power on Lumax and then not living up in contrast with Mike and El). Just like Will encouraging Mike, I think that implies that it wouldn't have happened without it.

I don't know if he's gay or liked El in season 1 but I do think that since season 2, he's been team Will. The playlist says that in early season 2, he feels guilty for uncontrollably getting over her no matter how hard he tries to hold on. From there, he kisses her in repayment for her coming back from to life. It's the least he could do.

I've also commented on how when he does initiate, the 1x08 kiss, the 2x09 kiss, he never smiles until she does. His goal is kissing her has always been to make her happy, not him in the end. But making her happy makes him happy so...he can live with that, right?

But when he was off the hook in season 3, there was a window of time where they were friends on good terms. And I don't think he was as able to come back from that dream the second time.

Reading what @gayofthefae wrote about Mike never initiating anything in his relationship with El, I had a thought. I was gonna just reblog, but it turned into something much bigger than planned.

You're mostly right, but I think you're simplifying a bit.

I think you're right that El initiates everything, but it results in Mike feeling like it's his responsibility to be her boyfriend. And he does admire her, we know that from how he talks about her.

We don't really know if Mike invited her to the Snow Ball in season 2. That information isn't provided. We know enough that El was aware of it since Hopper specifically asked Owens about El leaving the cabin for one night. This tells us that El asked Hopper about it. Yeah, she knew about the Snow Ball because Mike told her in season 1. It can be assumed that the others told her about this year's Snow Ball. Did Mike ask her to go? That's just unknown. He certain didn't expect her there, though, judging by his surprise when she arrived.

I do think that Mike wasn't thinking of El romantically through season 2, though. That was all her. He just felt horrible about what happened to her and wished for her to come back safe. You can see when she leaves to go with Hopper to the Gate that he doesn't respond as she leans in to kiss him. Between that and El arriving at the Snow Ball, I think he gets the message that he's supposed to be with her.

Mike didn't get back together with her in season 3, no. Not from what we could see, at least. He makes some efforts to smooth things over with her, but they're pretty half-hearted. Even his "blank makes you crazy" thing seemed more about trying to say it without saying it.

However, we can't ignore that he did blurt out "I love her and can't lose her again!"

But I think this is more about his fear of losing her than anything else. They're talking about using her and her powers, and all he's thinking about is how he thought she died in season 1 and had to watch her go off to the Gate in season 2. He knows overuse of her powers is dangerous for her, and I think he blamed himself for how she overused them in season 1.

He's never able to utter those words again to her, even when she all but begs him to, and I think that's telling. She says it directly to him as she gets ready to leave Hawkins, and he just freezes and stands there. This goes back to how I don't think they were back together at this point. Just like when she left for the Gate in season 2, El staked her claim. They were together again. Mike was stuck again.

I think Mike was being honest with Will when he said that she would figure out she didn't need him anymore. To him, being her boyfriend has been about keeping her close. He thinks that's all he is to her, and she'd eventually decide he wasn't worthy of her. She's a sort of status symbol for him, but not to show off to others, just for himself.

I think there might be a bit of truth to the whole "if I said it, it would hurt more" thing. Mike has terrible self-esteem, but having a literal superhero as a girlfriend, knowing that she chose him, makes him feel worthwhile. He's afraid of losing that because, to him, it would mean that he's not worth anything, after all.

So, yeah, Mike doesn't initiate anything. He wants her to. That was the point of "blank makes you crazy." He was testing the waters. He wanted to see if she'd say it. She didn't. Not because she didn't feel it, necessarily, but because she had no idea what he was talking about.

However, when she finally does say it later, he realizes that it didn't make him feel like he thought it would. It felt wrong. But, by now, he was in too deep. She just lost her dad. So he goes along with it, now fearing for the end of their relationship and what that would mean. It was easy while they were apart. He didn't have to worry about anything.

But, once they were back together...ooh, boy. It was clear the whole thing was a shitshow. Not only was he weird with El, but also with Will. It's important to remind people that Mike had seemingly made things right with Will before the Byers moved. We saw that he was back to being his nerdy self in Hawkins, playing D&D again even though he acted too cool for it in season 3. It's because El was gone. She never had an interest in his nerdy interests, so he pretended he didn't like it. He always tried to change himself around her to seem more "worthy."

Going to visit them in California, though, we see Mike is changed again. He's dressing differently. He seems to be trying to be trendier, which is called out by Argyle when he says its not Ocean Pacific, but "a shitty knockoff." It's not who he is. He's putting on a performance, just as he did in season 3. He plays the part of boyfriend, but can't manage it when it matters most. Just look at how callous he seems when El gets bullied. It's because she doesn't act like how he thinks a superhero would, and she even calls him out on it when she says he thinks she's a monster.

Mike is more genuine again after El leaves. He starts opening up to Will more, once again making things right with him. He's no longer playing a role. He's just Mike again. He tries to talk to Will about the problems he's having, and Will, the selfless little dummy, keeps reassuring Mike that they'll get back together because he assumes that's what they both want. However, Mike seems to resonate with Will's words when Will says that it can be hard to be honest with those important to you because they may not like the truth. The truth being "I'm sorry, but I don't love you like that, but having you choose me as your boyfriend is the only reason I think I'm worth anything."

Both Mike and El seem like they're on their way to being more honest with each other. El is realizing that seeing herself as a superhero is not a mature way to think. She left to become the superhero Mike wants her to be, but she learned that it wasn't what was best for her. She needed to accept herself and be her own person. Mike started to see that hiding the truth wasn't helping anyone. Unfortunately, Will's attempt to reassure Mike led to him pretending his feelings for Mike were hers. In his mind, if he sees Mike that way, then El must, too. Why wouldn't she? It's Mike.

However, El stops initiating. They share a forehead touch on their reunion, but that's it. She quickly notices Will, and, with Mike's help, goes to embrace him. We see no real conversation between them until the pizza place, where they share a rare genuine (and, curiously, not especially romantic) cute moment before El gets a solemn look on her face. She takes Mike's hands and makes him take the sensory deprivation glasses off to look at her. She's initiating something now, but it doesn't seem like it's gonna be happy and romantic. Unfortunately, Argyle took Jonathan's master class in "Interrupting Important Moments" and chose that moment to bring them some pizza. We can argue later about whether or not there's symbolism in Argyle and El forcing Mike to try something he wrote off as disgusting, only for him to concede he likes it.

Mike wouldn't have been able to do anything in the pizza place without Will. He was at a loss. Even after all that happened, and with El's life on the line, he's still hesitating. Selfless dummy Will just made things worse because he didn't realize it was a lie, so he pushes Mike to "be the heart." Mike's fear of losing El combined with Will's reminder of how El "always will" need her pushes him to say what he previously couldn't. Will is basically holding this ship together like in Spiderman Homecoming. Yet, we don't see Mike and El be remotely romantic afterwards. The most we see is El leaning on Mike in the hospital. She all but ignores him in the cabin later. You'd think that after what happened to Max she'd need his support.

I still can't understand why people think that monologue was romantic. I guess they haven't thought about what built up to it.

[kidovna]

Why do you think mike is bi?

I personally think that Mike did have a thing for El in s1, 2, and parts of s3, but started to realise that they weren’t really compatible as romantic partners once he started dating her (especially with her spying on him and dumping him publicly). I think Mike has a lot of issues with his current relationship with El but I don’t really think her being a girl is one of them.

Also, Mike being bi doesn’t take away from byler or add anything extra to mileven, so i don’t see why not? If the show proves me wrong and tells me Mike is indisputably gay, then obviously that is canon, because that is a possibility too. As of now, Mike doesn’t have a canon sexuality and I have a feeling that they won’t really go into it in s5

[apatheticlexicographer]

i think i finally understand the exact reasoning behind how both will and mike's sexualities are presented, and how those presentations flatter each other.

will is barely queercoded from a subtextual perspective because there's no need to queercode him. the writers verbally establish in season one episode one that people percieve this kid as gay, so you're immediately guided to see him through the same lens, at least subconsciously. people continue to refer to him as gay and he continues to "act" gay, and most of the audience is able to see this for what it is very easily without the need for heavy symbolism. will being gay is simply treated as a fact from the start by both the characters around him and the writers themselves, for better or for worse.

MIKE, on the other hand, is so heavily queercoded it's barely even funny. he's the one with the queer imagery, the blocking, the set design, the lighting. he's never explicitly referred to as queer, it isn't so much as suggested verbally, but the sheer amount of incredibly blatant subtextual material that surrounds him is insane. none of the characters within the show have the slightest clue that mike is gay. there's a good chance that mike himself doesn't know, or has only begun to realize very recently. even the writers do their damn best to make it appear like they themselves don't know. still, the fact remains that he is, it just isn't expressed in a way that the homophobic masses both within and outside the show are capable of picking up on. when he comes out it will be a shock to the characters and the majority heterosexual audience, but not to the queer people who pick up instinctually on the signalling. basically, you only know mike is gay if you have a genuinely functioning gaydar.

in this way they're so strongly representative of two very different gay experiences, both of which are important and both of which are treated respectfully by the writers, despite the setting.

will is the kid who never really gets the luxury of choosing whether to come out to people, because everybody has had him pegged from the start. even his own family: jonathan tells will he accepts him before will can even hint toward the topic himself. however as much as we're told that he "seems" gay to other people, all we are shown subtextually is a totally normal child who happens to have feelings for another boy. this is important because it subverts the trope of making "being gay" the "obviously gay" character's sole or core trait.

mike is the kid who people would never in a million years guess was queer. it's not just that he gets the luxury of choosing when to come out of the closet; he's so deep in it that he's drowning in winter coats. he's the "twist queer character," except he's not. his subtextual queercoding has been there beneath the surface for just as long as will has been textually referred to as queer on a surface level. this makes it clear that him being gay isn't some kind of last minute decision and the subtlety of his presentation wasn't an accident. if you don't knkw mike is gay now before it's revealed then you aren't supposed to.

they're foils like that. they're the archetypal queers, and i think it's kind of beautiful.

(and if anybody tries to argue that one expression of Queer Experience is more important than another then i'm coming for their kneecaps. having both experiences not only represented but thoroughly explored is so rare, although there are people all over the world who resonate with each.)

[chirpsythismorning]

Will Won't Believe Mike Has Feelings For Him, Until Mike Unpacks EVERYTHING!

In season 2, almost every touch between byler was initiated by Mike. Literally two episodes in a row at the start of that season, the camera focuses on Mike wrapping his arm around Will's shoulder warmly, only for us to never see this gesture from Mike again until s4, except this time it's with El (feat. Will in the background).

This is important because it means Mike went from initiating touch with Will in the earlier seasons, to not initiating it in the later ones, and conveniently right after he started having a relationship with El.

After holding back from initiating any contact with Will all of s3 (the same season almost all contact between them was initiated by Will for the first time), it's not until the end of the season that Mike lets go of his ih right as Will is about to leave for California, falling into his arms.

And then it takes the literal apocalypse, at the very end of s4, for Mike to wholeheartedly initiate contact with Will again (after yet another season of Will initiating most).

And so it makes sense why Will would be confused.

Because at the end of s3, Mike gives him the impression that he didn't want Will to join another party, with Will basically admitting that was the whole point of him donating the dnd game, because joining another party would literally be impossible for him, so like what's the point?

Will's feelings aren't going away. Whether or not Mike feels the same, is beside the point. Will still wants to be in Mike's life as his friend and he would be ecstatic to be best friends like they used to, entirely platonically.

After all, Will used to attribute Mike's behavior in earlier seasons as platonic, whereas bylers arguably viewed it as romantic. So Will's idea of romantic vs. platonic may very well be different than Mike's (and perhaps ours).

We tend to view those gestures as romantic, especially because Mike went from being able to do them nonchalantly, to now looking like a deer in headlights any time Will so much as slightly grazes his arm.

This is why I think Mike and Will's personal experiences with ih intersect and overlap. It affects them both differently, and that's probably because they had their realizations at different times, but it’s also probably because it started in environments that don’t resemble the exact same circumstances and experiences.

I do think because of Lonnie and because of Will's experiences growing up being bullied, he is understandably scared of being a target and that will never go away, it never does for queer people. That trauma is deep for Will and it's why he can't stand up for El in s4 when it comes to the bullies. It's why he freezes. And yet, even still, he seems a lot more comfortable in being who he is in a way that I just don't think Mike is, at least not fully or to the extent Will is (yet).

And it's because they are at totally different stages of their journey, journeys that are going to look totally different even side by side, but still qualify as both being worthy enough for acknowledgment in the end.

I hate the whole excuse regarding the girl in Will's class, because we don't really get much context there. But I'm guessing that Will obviously knew this girl sort of well. They're sitting next to each other in class, and he's been going to this school for about 6 months, so I highly doubt they are strangers.

I also am assuming they talked enough that this girl felt compelled to flirt by playing footsy, as opposed to her just being attracted to him and doing it on a whim. That obviously doesn't excuse her touching him without his consent, but what I'm trying to say is that there are girls that have liked Will for who he is, after getting to know him, who want to get to know him more romantically and he's just.... not having it.

And so if Will was craving normalcy to the point where he wanted to appear straight, dating a girl that is fully interested in him is obviously one of the popular options a person might consider in that situation. And Will's had this opportunity. This was just one of at least 3 in canon occurrences where a girl implied, 'Hey. I'm interested' towards Will. Which means all he would have to do is play along and he could keep his sexuality locked down and ignore his true feelings, by pretending to be happy in a heterosexual relationship.

We even have an unnamed fourth girl in the mix, who Will doesn't even know exists. This girl exists solely to make Mike insecure about his and Will's relationship. Because in contrast to Will, and most people that don't have extreme cases of ih, Mike views romantic relationships as shutting out everyone else, and he's scared that now that Will might be interested in a girl and moving towards a romantic relationship, he's going to shut Mike out and he'll lose him for good.

But Will doesn't have that same level of denial or self-hatred that might lead one to pursue or even simply draw out an unromantic relationship, at least not anymore. You could try to argue that in s2 Will did because he gave in and danced with the girl (at Mike's insistence), but since then, nothing.

Will is the kind of person that is comfortable enough in his sexuality to literally be single for the rest of his life, contentedly, because that would mean he doesn't have to pretend to be someone he's not to fit society's expectations. He's not scared enough about the implications of not having a gf and what people would think of him as a result. He is who he is and he's accepted that part of himself.

Mike on the other hand, has lots of expectations of himself, that he's sort of forcing himself to obey and follow. And he's also well aware of the implications of everything he does, especially when it relates to Will. He hyper-focuses on his actions and it's why he can't be fully honest about how he feels, and this is because how he has been acting as of late, is mostly an act in and of itself. An act that protects him from exploring the truth about his sexuality. An act that allows him to ignore it all together.

Every time Will has confronted Mike about his inability to be a good friend like he used to be, it's literally coming from a platonic place, not from a place of Will expecting Mike to return his love.

That's the thing, he doesn't think Mike could ever love him because he thinks Mike is straight. But he also (unlike Mike) doesn't have fears about Mike viewing his behavior as romantic, he just has fears that Mike doesn't want him as a friend anymore.

And I think that's the difference between Will's ih and Mike's.

Because Mike's ih is attributed to how he's been taught to believe he must grow up and be a certain way, according to bs media propaganda and from his family, along with how all of those ideas impacted him internally, since he has no one to really talk about it with.

And while Will has experienced some heinous shit in regards to his perceived sexuality at an extremely young age (a lot of which Mike witnessed right beside him or experienced himself firsthand) he doesn't apply those insecurities to his relationship with Mike. Even though Lonnie and those bullies and the scum of town broke him down, his mother loves him and his brother loves him and his best friend said asking him to be his best friend was the best thing he's ever done.

Mike doesn't have that kind of support going on for him when it comes to accepting his sexuality. He's scared, and understandably so.

This contrast between their characters is obvious in the way they go about their relationship, specifically in s4.

For example, Will doesn't view Mike not sending him letters as Mike turning him down romantically, he views it as Mike not caring about him at all, even as a friend.

And that's the main thing that made me have this realization about Mike's behavior in s4, and over the seasons in general because, to Mike, writing a letter to Will had romantic implications.

He sent letters to El and literally couldn't give in to send not even one letter to Will, and it's because, well, it would be too obvious (gay).

I imagine it's possible Will called Mike after they were settled in Cali, because he was still fairly certain they were on good terms considering how they left things (he has no idea Mike is spiraling over being recommitted to El again). Will had little reason to be insecure that Mike wouldn't want to talk to him, so I imagine that initially, things were at least fine.

But then it's been about a week and the Byers get a couple of letters in the mail, one for El and one for Jonathan, and... I can't even imagine what Will might have been feeling in that moment.

And then it happens again. And again. And Will is confused, because he thought they resolved things in their last conversation. He thought that they hugged and they were back to the way things used to be.

We even get this moment where Max is writing letters to everyone, EVERYONE, which makes me think Will did get letters from his other friends after the move, from Dustin, Lucas and even Max. And I think this can also be supported by a few other details. Bc if the phone line was busy, I don’t think any of the other friends would have a problem with writing Will a letter to reach him instead. And so by Dustin complaining about Mike was always whining about the Byers line being busy is an interesting choice bc, why wouldn't Dustin also complain? Wouldn't he want to call to talk to Will too.... Unless, Dustin is fully capable of getting his platonic Will fix via letters, EVEN probably ending them with love Dustin. (Will also knew what Lucas’ hair looked like in s4, which he would only really know if he got a picture of Lucas sent to him in the mail, most likely accompanied by a letter catching up).

I'm honestly guessing, that the only person who didn't write Will, not even once, was Mike.

It makes sense that in the time between s3-s4, Will attributed this behavior from Mike as him just reverting back to his s3 ways. He stopped focusing on Will and put all of his energy into worrying about El (again).

And so although Will doesn't make the effort to reach out to Mike as much as he could have, it's not because he's scared Mike will realize his feelings for him if he 'goes too far' or something. It's because he just genuinely thinks that Mike doesn't want to be his friend anymore.

And then the couple other times Mike himself calls the Byers over those 6 months, it's incredibly awkward. Something is off and Will doesn't know what it is or if it's his fault.

And this is why he puts his heart and soul into that painting.

The party was the last thing they talked about when they last saw each other. And that painting and what it represents reminds Will of a time when they were younger, when they could be themselves. Or more specifically when Mike could be himself and show how much he cared about Will, something he has been incapable of doing to the extent he would like to, for quite some time now. Will's holding onto this small ounce of hope that he just needs to prove to Mike that their friendship can still be what it used to be, if that's what Mike wants of course. And he's not scared that Mike is going to see this as romantic, or he's at least not worried about it. Why else would he put a heart on his shield and plan on giving it to him in front of everyone, in public?

Over the next few months, letters to El (from Mike), are arriving less and less over time, but they're still semi consistent. And all the while Will's just working on his painting with the purest and kindest of intentions.

Then, the day of their reunion finally comes and Will is so excited to hug Mike and give him the painting, but then suddenly, Mike is rejecting him. Instead of going in for a hug like he did at the end of s3, Mike makes his way towards Will, only to pull himself back and tap him on the shoulder instead before they can even hug properly.

Will looked very happy to see Mike, just like Mike did initially. However, in contrast, Will didn't hold himself back from the embrace at all, not until he saw Mike doing it.

Meaning ih wasn't in the way of Will in this moment, but it was in the way for Mike.

Mike's inability to simply hug him back like a friend hugs a friend, is when Will thinks, 'okay. so this painting is probably not the best idea.'

And then all day long, Will is moping, not even thinking about the implications of what it could look like. He doesn't care if he looks like a sad gay boy, because he is a sad gay boy.

Meanwhile Mike is smiling (painfully) most of the day, though we know because Mike lets it slip later, that he was too distracted by Will's moping to even enjoy himself. It was all an act. He was internalizing everything he was truly feeling and thinking in those moments.

Again we're seeing Will being quite capable of showing a full range of emotions, without him worrying about the implications that may come with it, whereas the implications of anything and everything Mike does (or even wears) is a guiding factor for why he is behaving the way that he is.

And then at Rink-O-Mania, Will says, 'what about us' and the entire byler community is gasping.. bc i mean, the guts?? the confidence? the self assurance that he must have had to say something so bold such as, 'what about us??', all while Mike is looking back at him fucking starstruck, wishing he had the balls to say something like that intentionally and not by accident.

Mike has started to be extremely careful about what he says, and in turn Will is having no choice but to do the same.

At this moment, Mike is still reeling from admitting to paying more attention to Will's mood than El who was lying straight to his face, and now Will is suddenly revealing to Mike that he missed him a lot and he was sad that Mike didn't call more...

But instead of Mike being like BRO I called. I called you every day for almost a year... he keeps his mouth shut.

This is the moment we finally see Mike's mask start to crack, because in this moment he reveals that he couldn't write to him because, "She's my girlfriend Will!" and "We're friends. We're friends.".

All of which are things Will never disputed as being basic facts.

The reality is Will isn't upset here because Mike doesn't want to do romantic coded things with him, he's upset because things that used to be platonic for them, that are platonic for most best friends, Mike is suddenly viewing as romantic now.

"But we used to be best friends," drives home this fact that Will's insecurities about their relationship are tied to Mike's behavior.

And then Mike's ih and 'detouring back into the closet' tendencies are back in full force, and it's causing Will to also cut himself short. Instead of being honest like he always is, he's stopping himself, because Mike is starting to change his tune.

It's why he walked away after the rain fight, and it's why he keeps his mouth shut instead of defending himself. Because this isn't how things used to be between them.

And that's what I find kind of tragic about their slow-burn, and I haven't seen anyone talk about this, which is that I think their experiences overlap.

I think that Mike's ih is starting to impact Will in a negative way. While Will has been learning to accept himself over the seasons, Mike's been learning to hide.

We've seen them go from a relationship early on where Mike was the reason Will accepted himself, to now being the reason he has to give him a veiled love confession, because at this point, Will has little reason to believe Mike could love him back based on his actions and his behavior.

At the end of s3, right before they hug, Will kind of just stands there waiting for Mike to hug him, like he's down to hug Mike, but only if that's what he wants. Will's ih is only starting to kick in at all now because Mike's has went from nonexistent, to value infinity. After a season of initiating all contact, Will is skeptical Mike even wants to hug him. But then Mike is falling into his arms and it's such a pure moment, because now Will is thinking, albeit bittersweetly, that things can go back to normal for them.

But they don't, with s4 essentially starting out as a repeat of s3.

Will is back to this trend of initiating all their physical contact again. First going in for a hug at the airport brightly (only to be shot down). Poking Mike in the chest at Rink-O-Mania when they're arguing. Grazing Mike's arm in the van when he gives him the painting. Reaching out to tap his shoulder during his monologue. Hugging Lucas with him. Elbowing him subtly to ask about how things are with El. These are all subtle moments where Will goes out his way to initiate touch with Mike, things that arguably Mike used to do with Will, but now only does extremely rarely, and most notably at the last second at the end of the season, after holding himself back the first 8 or so episodes.

I think what's so important about the way they approached this, is that in order for Will to truly accept and love himself, Mike has to accept himself too.

Without even realizing it, a long time ago, Mike made Will accept himself. Will was arguably experiencing a lot of ih in the first two seasons, but then suddenly it flipped, and now it's the other way around, with Will just being confused like I thought you cured me of this bro? wtf??

Will literally poured his heart out to Mike with that painting. He told Mike how he felt. He even spent the last year or so being fairly honest about how he viewed their friendship and about how he feels about him. And while Mike always makes the effort to correct things with Will, a lot faster than he does with anyone else, he's still leaving Will in the dark here.

Because while most bylers are fully convinced s4 ended things in a way that proves Mike is ready to be with Will once that opportunity arises, that doesn't mean Will is going to believe him.

Will doesn't end the season thinking Mike loves him, he ends it thinking the exact opposite.

It doesn't matter that Mike is finally reaching out to him again or that he's even standing right beside him at the end, because Will has already been through this with Mike.

He's already gotten hope that they could go back to how they were.

And even though their reconciliation in s4 seemed to resolve things, things still ended in a similar way to s3, only this time in a more grand way, with Mike telling El he loved her 9 times, and the added bonus that he apparently felt like his life started that day they found her in the woods (the same day Will went missing).

And so somethings gotta give. We cant just have a repeat of s3 and s4.

I think it's going to take A LOT for Will to even consider Mike could not only see him truly as a best friend again, but that he also returns his feelings romantically.

Sadly, despite all the beauty that is byler when it comes to them voicing how much they care about each other, Mike's inability to even want a platonic relationship is why they are in this situation in the first place. Because I honestly think Will is capable of a platonic relationship with Mike, whereas I do no think Mike is capable of having a platonic relationship with Will. And his attempts to hide his feelings have caused Will to be insecure about where their friendship lies.

And so it's going to require Will getting an explanation as to why Mike has been acting this way for so long.

Mike's not going to be able to end things with El and then manage to convince Will that its him who he loves.

This is where I think the letter comes in. I think that Will pouring his heart out in that painting, explaining all the ways Mike makes him feel like he's not a mistake, needs to be reciprocated in a similar way from Mike's end.

After the past few years of him making Will question everything he ever thought about their relationship, both Will and Mike deserve the closure that comes with acknowledging what the hell happened between them.

And I think the best way to do that is for Will to understand why Mike did what he did, because Will didn't personally have ih that gave him the urge to seek out, nor stay in unhappy relationships. Like I'm sure Will's fairly convinced that having a girlfriend is strictly straight behavior, as are most (uninformed) people.

If Mike wants to be with Will, he needs to give Will closure about why they went from best friends to strangers. And that is going to require Mike unpacking his ih in a way that Will is going to understand, once Mike finally acknowledges it instead of beating around the bush. Will is going to be able to be the thing that makes Mike accept himself, and vice versa.

And the way I think Mike is going to do that is IN A LETER (especially after convincing himself letters are romantic? boy! you better prove it!)

Once they finally do that, once they both speak to each other in their own personal love language (Will with his art and Mike with his writing), they'll finally understand each other and where they were both coming from.

And that's when they'll realize that they can overcome all these fears they've had growing up, everything that caused them this big mess in the first place, because they'll be able to get through it together.

And it's going to be so heartbreakingly beautiful and real that not even the ga is going to be able to be mad.

[gayofthefae]

He's trying...but he only has one reference point.

Did anyone notice that Mike kept trying to recreate moments he had with Will with El? (Because he loves Will but he's trying to love El( he failed)

He meant it platonically and she knows

He already knew El here so him saying his life started when they found El in the woods makes no sense( unless he meant it in a way that his life restarted because he found hope of finding Will) he only said those things because he thinks El commissioned the painting

The first thing he said when he first saw El was "that's not Will"

Plus his disgusted/confused face at Argyle's love at first sight for Eden should tell you everything (they made fun of that trope)

The writers don't believe in love at first sight

[gayofthefae]

Thinking about how Mike wasn't just told to like El then he liked her. No. There's a third event that happens between them that we skip over so often but is vital and Mike's crush might not have even happened without it.

Mike is being teased about El, yes. But he actually doesn't even get the chance to respond, let alone have his following actions be influenced by only that. Because before he can even react, look who's here:

Stakes.

This scene isn't about El. This scene plays out in one, very simple way.

Lucas: you like El.

Mike: I don't.

Troy: Let me remind you what will happen if you don't.

Just like the ily speech, Lucas is Will, but that's not all it took. It didn't just take the suggestion of something. It took the STAKES. It took threat. He was told to do something then he turned to see just what would happen to him if he didn't do it. The romantic trope is feigned: realize your feelings once someone points out that someone could be romantic. Steve has the same with Robin in season 3. But one thing here is different.

Before he has a chance to respond (to ensure we don't know what would have happened), he is given incentive to lie.

It isn't just suggestibility. "Huh, maybe I should like her. I guess I will." It's fear. It's "you need to hide, like right fucking now, and there's a hiding spot right there." Yeah. You run to the hiding spot and you do not fucking come out ever.

[rotisseries]

are y'all having bi mike vs gay mike vs unlabeled mike discourse again? we do this once a month guys jesus christ

[gayofthefae]

He is trying SO hard to not emotionally cheat on El that until he realizes it's hurting Will, compensating as much as he is really does feel like evening out to him.

my sweet boy was trying so hard to not emotionally cheat on El with Will even if he feels all weird about him since he left and missed him more than his girlfriend 😭😭😭

he's awkward at the airport and tries to keep his distance imo also because of his attraction to Will (even if I don't believe he 100% gets why he feels like he should act this way and why Will makes him feel SO nervous now)

he panics when he thinks Will is implying there's something more than friendship going on between them because he knows it's the truth

then Will tells him he just wants him back as a bestfriend and Mike calms down a little and immediately takes the opportunity as soon as they resolve their rink o mania drama... because he too wants them going back to being best friends like before Will left Hawkins and things got weird between them

but more time he spends with Will and more he thinks about his relationship with El more Mike becomes unsure of what he really wants to do "next"...

he thinks he wants to fix things with El but their relationship doesn't feel 100% right anymore, he's too afraid and doesn't believe she will stay and deep down he doesn't believe she loves him... he's scared of saying what he feels to her because he doesn't want to get hurt when she leaves again and he doesn't want to be vulnerable and confess his insecurities to her, they are not connecting emotionally and El left him behind on purpose AGAIN, showing him she really REALLY doesn't need him in her life... like he feared... so his brain is a mess now and they are in the desert and he can't help himself, he looks at the only person that can make him feel good like we previously established when only Will could make him feel better after El left him the letter and they didn't resolve their fighting...

in the desert Will catches him and suddenly all of this is too intimate and panic mode is back on!

and then BOOM it's the van speech time and that touches his soul and makes him feel SO loved and emotional

[castleclerics]

since ppl are talking about it one of the biggest reasons i think mike is gay and not bi is bc el this entire series has always thought that it was her. that she was the problem, the monster. if mike is bi then that means he was romantically in love with el but either fell out of love, or just likes will more than her. then she would still be stuck in the cycle of thinking it’s her, and that she wasn’t enough for mike even after him gassing her up about being a superhero/ “the most incredible person in the world.” (which narratively is confusing too and wouldn’t make sense).

if he’s gay she would finally have another moment of realizing it was never her. and it was never her own actions that made their relationship rocky like she might believe. mike being gay would help el understand why he acted the way he did since s3 and their relationship would only flourish and not have unresolved pieces floating around. she would be happy for mike and will too.

[pinksmonkey]

The Truth About Hosegate and Lover's Lake: Part 3

(An analysis by scrunchietown)

Here's Part 1 and Part 2 if you missed them.

That's all, thanks for reading. ☺️

🍕😱🍆 Lol

[alex-the-bringer-of-chaos]

Ok, since there's been a lot of infighting (for some fucking reason) over Mike's sexuality, allow me to state something: Who cares? As long as that bitch isn't straight and ends up with El there will be a satisfying story with good narrative being told.

Please finish reading before getting pissed off :D.

I understand that people want to see themselves represented (bitch I'm aroace and agender, I get it), but we don't need to fight over it. Make your analysis and why you think a certain way, but no need to attack one each other.

Now I gotta say something else: I don't care what Mike's sexuality is, as long as he ends up with Will. The reason for that, you ask? Well simple:

Independent el and byler endgame is the only happy and right ending - I've said that numerous times and the narrative agrees with it.

I'm saying this not because I think that his sexuality is irrelevant or cause I don't care about his character arch, quite the contrary. I think that, regardless of him being gay, bi, pan, queer or unlabeled, Mike will have a satisfying storyline and character arch. A good one, that will make sense with the narrative of the show. And we will get to analyze it. A thing that won't happen if he's straight and milkvan is endgame - cause that would be a shit story due to garbage narrative.

Now obviously some people have their reasons for preferring and believing in one outcome over the other, and that's okay, as long as your not a pussy and a little bitch about it. That's all. Thanks for reading folks. Please don't come at me with pitchforks if you wanna hate, just block me.